It looks like a great site!

Regarding the speculation about Mr. Zouher Hamad comment and to be quick to dismiss it as a ‘nonsense’ I want to point out a very important comment came out from one of All4Syria moderator:

????? ??????
???? ????????? 2010-05-20 13:03:01
???? ?? ?????? ???????? ???? ????? ????? ????? ???????? ??????? ????????? ?? ?????? ?? ????????? ???????? ????
?? ???????? ????? ?? ????
??? ????? ???? ??? ??????? ?????? ??????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??????????? ??????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ??? ????? ?? ?????? ????? ??????? ?? ????? ??? ?????? ?[[[[??????? ?????]]]] ???? ???? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ?????? ????

I believe that Zouher Hamad was allowed to use his real name in the comment section of all4syria on purpose by the Syrian government. It is meant to send a clear message to expats to behave themselves or else they will face consequences at home. One has to keep in mind that even if an expat holds dual citizenship, and he or she was born in Syria, then his or her adopted country has no means of protecting him or her against the laws of his or her country of birth. I also read on All4Syria a clear warning sent to the person behind this website by name by a commentator who signed under the name “From Qirdaha” (i.e. from the hometown of Bashar). He seems to implicate some obscure Brigadier General and the Syrian ambassador in US and promising severe punishments. The commentator started by ridiculing the person behind it as a non-relevant seeking fame and money.

The swift actions of the Syrian government proves once again that it is a true national governmnet doing its best to safguard Arab and Syrian interests against the misbehaviours of those who follow their shortsightedness and act not very ‘honorably’.

We must thank Bashar and his good government again for being alert.

More analysts see Turkey as the emerging global power that will come about as a historic certainty, despite desperate attempts by Obama plus the other 5:

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2010/0519/Turkey-s-work-on-Iran-nuclear-deal-shows-emerging-diplomatic-power

Don’t be silly Al Masri, Turkey just suffered a huge blow after its efforts to help out its friends in Tehran were dismissed by the UN Security Council.

Feltman Says Syria Must Curb Arm Shipments to Hizbullah
Assistant U.S. Secretary of State Jeffrey Feltman on Thursday urged Syria to do more to prevent arms shipments Hizbullah and stop the flow of militants into Iraq.
Feltman said that while relations remain uneasy, Syria was important to achieving a full Arab-Israeli settlement.

He told reporters at the U.S. Embassy in Jordan that Washington wants to influence Damascus because of its ties to Iran and other U.S. foes in the region.

Feltman said that because Syria has the ear of Hizbullah, Iran and Hamas, the Obama administration felt it must make its own views known to Damascus to ensure peace and security in the region.(AP)

As an independent observer, with respect to the Golan situation between Israel and Syria, I would like to ask the following question to both parties. How is settlement expansion in the Golan viewed as a perceived threat?

zionists who live as donmahs and conspire against other nations from the underground, will not consider adopting Muslim names as any blow to their self-esteem,

http://engforum.pravda.ru/showthread.php?283867-Zionist-Role-in-Armenian-Genocide-(Mustafa-Kemal-Was-Jewish)

in arabic we say: if you lose your sense of shame (honor), then feel free to do whatever you want.

I agree with Masri, Hassan.
Turkey did not “suffer a huge blow”; Turkey’s aim is to see this issue resolved peacefully. Turkey and the Turks don’t want to see armed with nuclear weapons Iran. It’s ridiculous to consider turkey and Iran as friends. They will never be friends. Limited allies at most, sharing some interests. Friends? No.
.

BigB:

That is a good question. However, since the Golan Heights has been annexed into Israel, the cities and towns in the Golan aren’t technically settlements. It is quite different from the West Bank. The continuing development of the Golan isn’t likely to threaten Syria as the border has been calm since the 1973 war. Syria’s support for the Palestinian terrorist organization Hamas and Lebanese Hezbollah is the primary source of contention.

Here’s the Qirdaha threat, I mentioned in 3, for those who haven’t read it:

http://all4syria.info/content/view/26486/161/

?? ???????? 2010-05-20 00:30:56
________________________________________
?? ????? ????? ??? ?????? ?? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ?
???? ?????? ?? ??????? ?? ????? ?????? ?????? ?
???? ??????? ??? ???? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ?
?????? ???? ??? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ?????? ??? ??????? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ????????
???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??????? ????? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ?? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ??????? >>>>>> ??????? ??? ???????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ?? ?????? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ?? ??????? ??? ????? ?????

I’m curious about who that Brigadier General with the obscured name might be. Any clues?

Almasri !

You mean did not know?? … Joshua Landis is the secret Brigadier General!

Mr. Qirda7a wannabe is totally clueless

Henry, that’s really amusing. Israel unilaterally Anschlusses the occupied areas of Golan and East Jerusalem, in defiance of international law, and the other 99.5% of the world is supposed to think that that means something significant?

Alex @12,

You mean Joshua Landis, the Professor at Oklahoma U, is a secret Brigadier General? In which army? The US? I thought Mr. Qirdaha was talking about a Brigadier General in the Syrian army!

The 50 most influential Jews in the world according to the Jerusalem Post.

#1. Bebe Netanyahu. #2. Ben Bernanke. Head of the US Federal Reserve

#3 Rahm Emanuel. chief of Staff to President Obama. Followed by David
Axelrod, chief advisor to President Obama; Alan Dershowits and supreme
Court Justice Elena Kagan is # 10.

http://www.jpost.com/JewishWorld/JewishFeatures/Article.aspx?id=175871

http://syria-news.com/readnews.php?sy_seq=115120

That is what Israel is ,

Ah yes, “shared humanity” with occupiers, killers and racists coming mainly from the US and other European countries! Those undercover Zionists and token Arabs never get tired from trying a new trick to get the racist Zionist entity accepted. It will never happen.

Ah yes, shared humanity with occupiers, killers and racists coming mainly from the US and other European countries! Those undercover Zionists and token Arabs never get tired from trying a new trick to get the racist Zionist entity accepted. It will never happen.

Dear Alex,
Your love to Syria, your patriotism, and your relentless efforts to bring out everything good about it are honorable and admirable. No one will ever take that away from you. You are a genuine, courageous, and an inspiring Syrian that makes me proud. March on.

Helena,

Your reference to Nazi Germany is no surprise. I saw you speak at the Middle East Institute in September 2009. Many of us in the audience were quite taken aback by your fawning portrayal of Hamas’ rule in Gaza. You seemed to admire the suicide bombing Islamist terrorist group. Have you lost your moral compass?

Henry,

cc: Helena Cobban

Considering the comments on her website and the titles of her articles, it looks to me like were dealing with the typical liberal Arabist point-of-view. You know…Israel can’t defend herself, or Israel has to defend herself “proportionately”, or Israel is an “Apartheid State”, all while excusing away the horrible crimes of Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Arab governments that prop them up.

We all know what JFK did when missiles were brought into our own hemisphere. But Israel, well, they just have to live with whatever threats that pile up at their border.

http://helenacobban.org/

Helena Cobban has the same rights as anyone on this forum to express her views.

It seems that the logic of the pro-israel/zionists is that its perfectly logical for Israel to continue to occupy lands acquired by war and its illogical and even \”evil\” for any of her neighbors to attempt to recoup such lands by war like actions.

Which makes a reasonable individual posit their reactions by proclaiming; “who the f#c$ do these people think they are?”

President Truman put it in more context when he wrote, “”I find (the Jews) are very very selfish. They care not how many Latvians, Finns, Poles, Estonians and Greeks )one needs to add Palestenians) get murdered or mistreated as DPs [displaced persons] as long as Jews get special treatment. Yet when they have power, physical, financial or political, neither Hitler or Stalin has anything on them for cruelty or mistreatment for the underdog.”

Ghat,

I hope you don’t mind, but I’m adding this article from Abe Foxman in addition to the anti-semitic statements you quoted from Harry Truman…

http://www.adl.org/anti_semitism/oped_truman.asp

[…] to Damascus because of the launch of OneMideast, which sounds like a ludicrous claim to me (and to Josh Landis as well). Be sure to read the comment section as well, but here’s the report […]

Ghat,

No one is questioning her rights. I am questioning her reference to Nazi Germany when discussing Israel’s annexation of the Golan Heights. It is highly irresponsible, to put it lightly.

I would question your anti-semitic quote. This is not the forum for that racist language. Simply framing it in quotes does not change a thing. Alex and Josh have rules on the site regarding racism.

Henry: I have the same rights as you in calling anyone a racist.

My logic is that if Israel has the right to continue to expand its territory as well as its occupation of the Golan, Syria has an equal right to get it back in the fashion that Israel did in occupying it. If you do not admit to such logic then you are a racist.

Israelis maintain their right to an exclusive state for Jews only by force. So do not mealy mouth your exclusiveness as a principled commentor. Did or did not Israel get to occupy the Golan by military actions?

That antisemitic quote you referenced was made by a President who recognized the state of Israel within minutes after the UN approved the resolutions creating it.

Maintaining over a million human beings in a prison called Gaza for years. Now that racism. If a million Jews were imprisoned in a similar coumpound would you not call it racism too. Is that not basically what the Nazis did to the Jews?

Henry,
You gave Israel the right to annex the Golan heights. Therefore, it is your reasoning that should be questioned and not Helena’s.

Are you giving Israel the right to annex the Golan?

More importantly: Israel stole Palestine – all of it. Palestine should go back to its original owners and the refugees must go back to their homes. Don’t you think? Hamas or any other Palestinian organization has the right to use all means available to achieve the return of the refugees to their homes and get Palestine back from foreign Jewish settlers. That makes sense, don’t you think?

No. Its not basically what the Nazis did to the Jews. Absolutely not. Hitler gassed 6 million civilians. The children would arrive at Auschwitz and immediately be sent to the gas chambers.

Israel is simply deciding not to trade or send aid to an area that is hostile to it. If the leadership of that area decides to recognize Israel and cease its hostilities I’m sure things would be quite different, as they are in the West Bank. Now that is hardly the Holocaust.

Ah yes, Helena Cobban. She wrote a book on the PLO in the 80s that I read. She portrayed the PLO in a positive light when they were busy killing Lebanese. There is a great review of it up on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/review/0521272165/ref=cm_cr_dp_hist_3?ie=UTF8&2115RYYWHP0B4F87UHelpfulReviews1.s=SUCCESS&2115RYYWHP0B4F87UHelpfulReviews1.v=1&filterBy=addThreeStar&voteError=0

” A Flawed Analysis of the PLO, December 7, 2005
P. Smyth

This review is from: The Palestinian Liberation Organisation: People, Power and Politics (Cambridge Middle East Library) (Paperback)
Helena Cobban, a noted reporter on Middle Eastern affairs has done a less than fair job with this book. The best portions of the book had more to do with the structure (political and military) of the PLO than with history. There were many problems with the book, for one there was no index! Cobban frequently used her own articles such as her dispatch to the Christian Science Monitor (pg. 288) and article in Atlantic Monthly (to name a few) as source material. She even cites her articles in the third person, “see Helena Coban, ‘The Building Called Mercy’.”

In terms of historical objectivity the book is severely lacking, in one instance Cobban mentions how Israel killed 23 on a raid on the Palestinian controlled Lebanese town of Damour (in retaliation for the assasination of an Israeli diplomat in Paris and numerous cross-border attacks); at the same time there was no mention of how the Palestinains came in control of the town through massacring, raping, and pillaging the Lebanese Christians who lived there. Cobban like many reporters close to the PLO during the Lebanese Civil War was little more than a passive mouthpiece for PLO propaganda.

The only reason I give this 3 stars is because it gives an excellent outline to the organizational structure of the PLO and the semi-seperate groups inside the PLO (such as the PFLP, DFLP, and smaller groups such as the ALF).”

I don’t understand why her site is a “.org.” Sites ending in “.org” are supposed to be not-for-profit, but that site is entirely self-promotion.

Finally, anyone living in the US should be very concerned about the organisation that she works for. On its Board of Directors sat Abdurahman Alamoudi, who declared at a demonstration in front of the White House, “‘We are all supporters of Hamas. I wish they add that I am also a supporter of Hizballah.”

Henry,

Thank you for your comment. However, with all due respect, I would like to take issue with what you stated about “settlements” not being an issue in the Golan because they are not “technically” settlements. In the book, “The Truth About Camp David,” the follwoing was said about Ehud Barak’s Golan strategy. “Just as it had been the customary practice on the Palestinian track, Barak used settlement expansion on the Golan Heights both as a form of obtaining negotiating leverage with Syria and as a means of reassuring right-wing supporters of his government.” That would lead me to believe that settlements, apart from military conflict (such as the 1983 Lebanon War), is a policy implemented to secure Israel’s northeastern flank. Understanding that Syria needs to find a more constructive means to regain the Golan, apart from proxy attacks, the promotion of settlement expansion, however, gives Israel a convenient “out” of negotiations over the Golan. All that needs to be said to fudge negotiations is that Israeli civilians are at risk. Yet IDF drills are routinely carried out over the region. So the question is, who is threatening who? Is it appropriate for Syria to view settlement exapnsion as a threat?

BIGB

Its evident that discussions and exchanges between “the chosen people” and others is almost a lost cause. The view that Jews are a distinct people with a primary commitment to Israel and the Jewish community is forthrightly affirmed by Elliott Abrams, who was President George W. Bush’s senior advisor for “global democratic strategy,” and in 2006 was a key advisor on Middle East affairs to the US Secretary of State.

In his book Faith or Fear: “How Jews Can Survive in Christian America,” he writes: “Outside the land of Israel, there can be no doubt that Jews, faithful to the covenant between God and Abraham, ARE TO STAND APART from the nations in which they live. It is the very nature of being Jewish to be apart — except in Israel — from the rest of the population.” Judaism and the Jewish way of life,” writes Abrams, is not “entirely voluntary, for the Jew is born into a covenantal community with obligations to God.” Jews, he goes on, “are in a permanent covenant with God and with the land of Israel and its people”.

The Jewish sense of alienation from, and abiding distrust of, non-Jews is also manifest in the creation of roups such the ADL, AIPAC etc,. as well as an insistance of a distinct and separate state. Anyone not agreeing with their views is automatically an anti-semite. Interestingly their attitude is that they are APART but that anyone calling attention to their being APART is called antisemitic.

In a sense one can only conclude that what is accepted in general by the population of this planet {some 7.+ billion humans) does not mean diddly to the “chosen people”. Thus a settlement in one area does not necessarily equate to a settlement in another area.

The Stern Gang, the Irgun Zvai Lumi and like others are freedom loving patriots and heroes whereas Hamas and Hezballah and to a certain extent the Syrians are the evil terrorists. Daily flights over Lebanon are explained as a defensive preemption while if Syria were to do the same over Tel Aviv their planes would be shot down.

Israel it seems has the right to have several numbers of nuclear weapons and the rest of the world must not have any. Israel has the ineliable right to militarily occupy other peoples lands and territotries. As mentioned by one of their General’s, “Israel must act like a mad dog to threaten its neighbors”. Human nature being what it is there will come a time when the mad dog will be put to rest. Unfortunately many innocent people will pay with their lives.

Helena Cobban Update:

Apparently it gets worse, much worse. She is the Executive Director of the Council for the National Interest. Well if the name isn’t creepy enough, it turns out that the Abdul-Rahman Al-Amoudi, who oversaw the organization as part of its Board of Directors, was conducting “illegal dealings with Libya and conspiracy to assassinate Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah Bin Abdul-Aziz.”

http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2004/714/in3.htm

Jews have the obligation to vacate Palestine because Palestine does not belong to terrorist settlers. Furthermore, the Jews must apologize to the Palestinians for the crime of stealing what doesn’t belong to Jews (come on guys this stealing business has been going on for millenia and it is time that you should learn how to behave). If this so-called deity that the Jews believe in is a good deity then it should at least have the common sense of informing other people of so-called special status of the Jews. Furthermore if this deity is engaged in real estate business, then it must have the courtesy of asking the original owners of certain lands about their opinions before allocating resources contrary to their wishes. Unfortunately, this so-called Jewish deity didn’t do either of the above. Therefore, it either doesn’t exist and was fabricated by the Jews or it is a false god.

So far, I have not heard from any deity about special status of so-called Jews or zionists or that Palestine should belong to other than its true owners that are the Palestinian Arabs. Actually, if they do not stop their habit of stealing, I may have to conclude that they have lower status than everyone else.

All anyone talks about on this blog is Israel and how terrible the Zionist entity is. Doesn’t this play right into the Baathist’s hands? Bashar and Rami Makhlouf and all of the rest of the shilla in power don’t want anyone critiquing their policies. Compare the level of development of Syria to other countries in the Mashreq. They would prefer that you spend your time criticising the Jews and Israel. As long as you do that you are focused on something outside of Syria and from the sight of their failures. Through the conflict they can rally people behind the regime under the guise of supporting the nation. This way, if you aren’t supporting the regime during this time of conflict they can simply say that you aren’t nationalist enough.

Ghat Albird,

Thank you for your comment. I understand the premise of your comment. I also wonder, at times, why Elliot Abrams was even allowed to serve in the US government after his previous debacle. I have to, with all due respect, ask a question. Setting aside the deeply profound issue, on both sides, regarding the establishment of the state of Israel and inter-Arab dynamics, I would have to say that Israel’s behavior based on suspicion was warranted, due to early conflicts post-Lebanon. However, a line has to be drawn when the perception of intent has been reduced. Is it currently the intent for Syria to use what ever means are at their disposal to regain the Golan? There have been some interesting developments in the M.E. that lead me to believe that it might be in Syria’s best interest to disengage with its support of proxies and show that it is in Syria’s interest to use leverage via an old ally, Turkey. Now that might be a naive statement on my part, but I find it hard for Israel to still consider Syria as much of a threat to the Jewish state with respect to the kind of power Syria had in the 60’s and 70’s. Is it still in the interest of Syria to remain close to the Persian state of Iran, or can there be a more effective alliance that would reduce the suspicions of the Israeli’s? Or, have we reached a point where nationalism is trumping effective bargaining?

Again, thank you for responding to my post. This is my first time engaging in this forum and I appreciate and respect everyone’s point of view.

If this so-called deity that the Jews believe in is a good deity then it should at least have the common sense of informing other people of so-called special status of the Jews.

Al-Masri,

Which deity gave Muslims special status over the dhimmis, kuffars and infidels?

“More importantly: Israel stole Palestine – all of it. Palestine should go back to its original owners and the refugees must go back to their homes. Don’t you think? Hamas or any other Palestinian organization has the right to use all means available to achieve the return of the refugees to their homes and get Palestine back from foreign Jewish settlers. That makes sense, don’t you think?”

It is unfortunate that people on Syria Comment are still fighting the war of ’48.

There is so much that is factually incorrect about the above statement that I just could not resist. Okay, first we’ll start with “Israel stole Palestine…” Actually, Israel was given half of Palestine by the UN. The UN decision came out of the fact that there were two nations living on the land leading them to believe that the only manageable outcome would be two states. The Arabs living in Palestine at the time (many had immigrated to Palestine because of its buoyant economy) were offered (you might say offered to steal) a state as well. It was their rejection that resulted, ultimately, in their complete loss of Palestine. This is because Jordan and Egypt moved in during the war in 1948 and did in fact steal the rest of Palestine.

Second, you wrote “Israel stole Palestine – all of it.” Okay well we’ve already established that it wasn’t theft and that the only robbers were the Jordanians and Egyptians, but let’s talk about the “all of it” part. It would appear that Israel is giving Gaza and the parts of the West Bank that are heavily populated with Arabs to Arabs. Therefore, “all of it,” does not seem accurate if they are leaving much of Palestine for the Arabs?

“Palestine should go back to its original owners and the refugees must go back to their homes. Don’t you think?”

Its original owners. Would that be the UN? Britain? The Ottoman Empire? The Romans? The Jews? Whomever the original owners are they certainly aren’t Palestinians as they never owned that land. When Jews arrived they most often purchased land from absentee landlords in Damascus and Beirut.

“The refugees must go back to their homes.” The war occurred in 1948, do the math. Very few of the refugees remain with us.

Back to the original question “Palestine should go back to its original owners and the refugees must go back to their homes. Don’t you think?”

The original owners are either the Ottoman Empire, the British or the Jews. The Ottoman Empire doesn’t exist so naturally we can agree it shouldn’t go to them. However, I would support British administration as they are sometimes develop effective system of governance. The British however are over the colonial enterprise so that’s not an option, which leaves us with the Jews. Coincidentally, we do in fact have Jewish administration of Palestine, and they seem to be developing the country extremely (relative to say Syria) and to your point they could be the original owners, so I can’t object.

Henry @37,
You have not established anything but so-caleed zionist theft of Palestine.

Britain did not own Palestine even though it illegally appointed itself administrator through an illegal mandate from so-called League of Nations. the League of Nations does not own Palestine.

The Ottomans also did not own Palestine.

The original owners of Palestine are the Palestinian Arabs who lived there for millenia and legally owned 97% of Palestine when another illegal body which you call UN decided to santion theft by allocating over 70% of Palestine to illegal settlers. You can easily research the figures I qouted and satisfy yourself. So I will not bother.

Furthermore, you will not get away by legalizing theft under the disguise of so-called development. You can only develop what you legally own not what you steal from others.

The Jews must go back to where they came from and hand over Palestine to its legal owners, i.e. the Palestinian refugees. In the meantime, Hamas or other Palestinians have the full right to use whatever means to achieve that.

“Furthermore, you will not get away by legalizing theft under the disguise of so-called development.”

Israel was just invited to join the OECD, the club of the world’s richest countries. Now that’s not merely “so-called development,” but rather a highly developed economy. How’s the Palestinian Authority doing? Or any government in the Levant?

“The Jews must go back to where they came from and hand over Palestine to its legal owners, i.e. the Palestinian refugees. In the meantime, Hamas or other Palestinians have the full right to use whatever means to achieve that.”

I’m sorry, but the passage of time has changed a few things. Most of the Jews living in Israel today were born there. Thus, those individuals are in fact from that country.

Since the war occurred in 1948, which is 62 years ago, very few of the refugees are still alive. A person who was 25 in 1948, is now 87.

You say that “Hamas or other Palestinians have the full right to use whatever means to achieve that (conquest).”

Including this?: http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=AWjNxKECkxY&feature=related

Or the cowardly use of 14 year old children as suicide bombers?

AlMasri,

If everyone “goes back to where they came from”, how do you envision most white Americans moving back to their respective European countries? America does, after all, belong to the native Indians, not to George W. Bush or Barack Obama. I suppose a good bit of Hungary and Finland should move back to Mongolia as well.

I am not justifying the suffering of any indigenous population, not in the present or the past. But when we come up with solutions, we should try to be realistic, don’t you think?

Time doesn’t change anything. Palestine still belongs to the Palestinian refugees or their descendants until forever. Any so-called israeli who was born in Palestine is born illegally as a proceed of crime – also forever (i.e. forever criminal). He/she can find out which country his/her parents came from and take a flight over. I assume they all have return tickets.

Hamas has the right to use anything in its fight.

Hungary, Poland or USA is none of your business. Palestine is diffrent. It belongs to the Palestinian Arabs. It has to go back to its original owners.

AlMasri (assuming that is your real name),

The last thing we need in the Middle East is a state controlled by Hamas. Any more Iranian satellites and the entire Middle East will explode. Its bad enough that Iraq and Lebanon have to contend with Iranian violence. Just imagine what would happen to Egypt if there was a larger Hamas run territory on its border.

Syriacomment needs to find a solution for zionists posting under Muslim names.

We (Muslim commentators) cannot address zionists using such Muslim names. Because we would be committing the great sin of according such people undesreved honors.

From Palestine Betrayed by Efraim Karsh:

“While underscoring “the right of the Arab refugees to return to their homes in Jewish-controlled territory at the earliest possible date,” [Count Bernadotte’s] report also considered the possibility of resettlement outside Palestine, with those who chose not to return being adequately compensated for their lost property. “It must not… be supposed that the establishment of the right of refugees to return to their former homes provides a solution to the problent,” the report read. “The vast majority of the refugees may no longer have homes to return to and their resettlement in the State of lsrael presents an economic and social problem of special complexity. Whether the refugees are resettled in the State of Israel or in one or other of the Arab States, a major question to he faced is that of placing them in an environment in which they can find employment and the means of livelihood. But in any case their unconditional right to make a free choice should be fully respected.”

This principle was duly incorporated into General Assembly Resolution 194, passed on December 11 after a three month deliberation of the mediator’s report, which placed repatriation on a par with resettlement elsewhere. It advocated, in its own words, that “the refugees wishing to return to their homes and live at peace with their neighbors should he permitted to do so at the earliest practicable date,” but also that efforts should be made to facilitate the “resettlement and economic and social rehabilitation of the refugees.”

In tacit acceptance of the Israeli position, the resolution did not treat the refugee problem as an isolated issue but as part of a comprehensive settlement between Israel and its Arab neighbors. All of its fifteen paragraphs deal with the facilitation of peace, including the single paragraph that alludes to refugees in general – not “Arab refugees” – in language that could as readily apply to the thousands of Jews driven from their homes in the prospective Arab state and Jerusalem by the invading Arab armies. Moreover, the resolution expressly stipulated that compensation for the property of those refugees choosing not to return “should he made good by the governments or the authorities responsible,” indicating that the Arab states, as well as Israel, were seen as instigators of the refugee problem. be it Arab or Jewish.

It was just these clauses in Resolution 194 that made it anathema to the Arabs, who opposed it vehemently and voted unanimously against it. Equating return and resettlement as possible solutions to the refugee problem; placing on the Arab states some of the burden for resolving it; and, above all, linking the resolution of this issue to Arab acquiescence in the existence of the state of Israel and the achievement of a comprehensive Arab-Israeli peaoe were seen, correctly, as rather less than useful to Arab purposes.”

Henry said
I’m sorry, but the passage of time has changed a few things. Most of the Jews living in Israel today were born there. Thus, those individuals are in fact from that country.

Since the war occurred in 1948, which is 62 years ago, very few of the refugees are still alive. A person who was 25 in 1948, is now 87.
THis is silly
the theives that steel ,after a while it belongs to them!
Henry should be ashame of saying silly thing like this

“Henry should be ashame of saying silly thing like this”

Majed,

These people think they are “developed thieves”. So being a thieve to them is very honorable. So do not expect such people to feel ashamed of doing anything.

Didn’t you also read his other nonsense,

“Israel was just invited to join the OECD, the club of the world’s richest countries. Now that’s not merely “so-called development,” but rather a highly developed economy”??

This is what you may call highly developed robbery.

Sheesh talking about kleptomaniacs… as if ethnically cleansing the Jews of Egypt in order to gobble up all their property wasn’t heinous enough… Sure we’ll return to “were we came from”, as soon as you vacate our houses in Cairo and Alexandria and come up with compensation and compounded interest for all the money and property you stole. When you deposit that into an escrow account, and prove that it would be safe and beneficial to come back, and apologize sincerely, perhaps we’ll consider it.

Now let’s hear your racist excuses on how the Egyptian Jews “deserved it” or that it was a “regrettable mistake”. This is getting old and tired.

Norman (#16)

Look at this, and notice the forest around (minutes 1:10-2:30).
I don’t know if Israel was responsible for this fire, but if so, this video explain to you why.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tosEnhA9SLk&feature=player_embedded
.

Amir,
I could not open the link but the fire in my note is from the Golan and i think your video indicate resistance tunnels and as you know that does not apply to the GOLAN , as no resistance is going on there ,

Yossi, Shai, Almasri and everybody else ,

I think your tones are very heated and point out to hatred which is not in the best interest of our region , don’t you think?,

Yossie
The jews came from Ur they left Ur with your own choice. and in Egypt you were slaves you own nothing

Majid,

Thank you. Very deep.

Norman,

We’re not Christians… (you know “turn the other cheek” and all that)… 🙂

Norman,

The video is indeed from S. Lebanon. It is not about “resistance”.
It is about international / worldwide Guerrilla tactics.
And an Iranian / revolutionary-guards money and thinking. It has no meaning whether it is in Lebanon or Syria. The principles are the same, and so is the planning and the intentions.

Yossi,

Do you become Zionist again? Or post ‘post-Zionist’ ?
.

Yossi,

That was funny ,

Norman,

I do not find anything heated up. So do not worry.

Majed @50

Your answer is very clear and to the point even without going to details – thanks.
But here are some details for the record. The so-called Jews of old times came to Egypt and the first thing they did they sold one of their own to slavery. They were Bedouins and accustomed to doing mischievous acts. The Egyptians were kind to them and they accepted them as slaves in the hope they will get rehabilitated. Slaves as Majed made it clear do not own anything. In fact, they themselves were owned by their masters, in this case the old Egyptians. Eventually, the Egyptians got tired of them because they did not show an ability to rehabilitate and so they were kicked out. I can only blame the old Egyptians for not trying harder to rehabilitate them. So, whether you (@51) turn your cheek one way or the other, Egypt remains the brow above your eye – if you know what that means. If not, ask. Many Arabs can explain it to you.

An eyebrow? Nah, if you have to think of yourself as a hairy body part, start thinking in a different direction. A lower-body posterior one.

“Hungary, Poland or USA is none of your business. Palestine is diffrent.”

Well, Almasri, if Poland is none of my business, then neither is Palestine yours.

If everyone should “go back”, you might want to at least seem to be fair, and not innately against Jews.

Norman, I’m not upset. This racist Egyptian couldn’t upset me if he tried.

Shai, Yossi, Norman:

Call it racism, verbal diarrhea, hot potatoe…the loud mouth we have here doesn’t speak for 80% of the Arabs.

On second thoughts, Egypt has the moral responsibility to take the Jews back as slaves in order to solve the problem of the theft of Palestine. Even though, the old Jews came in mischievously and uninvited to old Egypt, the Egyptians must have tried harder as I said before to rehabilitate them into the civilized world. Jews must understand this time, however, that there is no room for mischief, and slaves live as eunuchs in Egypt. So welcome back to castration house. Any Jews who have abnormal sexual tendencies such as an urge to fill up a posterior hole may have to look somewhere else – check out with the Americans or the Polish, they may be interested.

Let’s hear you speak Mr. 80% Arab.

what’s up with mentioning All4Syria along CNN in the title? I mean I like All4Syria and all.. I read it.. but c’mon

Israel is a fascist state !.

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/special-place-in-hell/special-place-in-hell-rebranding-israel-as-a-state-headed-for-fascism-1.290977

Husam,

You’re absolutely right. I know he doesn’t speak on behalf of most Arabs. His choice of fighting “on behalf” of the Palestinians with his own version of racism is counterproductive. It only helps other racists hate him just as much.

HolyLand was, is and always will be the property of the Jewish people and nation.

If you don’t agree, go and drink from the sea of Gaza.
.

Amir
You are wrong

Almasri,

Your comments are becoming increasingly anarchist and racist, and we already have enough of that in the region. Please weigh in on what you’re saying before posting it. Vicious attacks on “Jews” does not serve anything and is morally wrong so please stop it.

Who knows what the future holds. If Israelis fail to integrate with the region on an equal and fair basis, then they may well end up like the Crusaders, and may well end up getting kicked out of the region.

But that would be at a huge blood cost to both sides and would wedge great hatred for millennia to come. I really don’t want that.

Instead, Israelis can choose to change their ways and their approach, and agree to the only viable solution, which is a One State solution, where Arab and Jew can live and work together in a natural, normal country that belongs to all its citizens. They have to stop coming up with the mutated creations they’re offering the Palestinians such as a state over walled ghettos, that does not own its air space, nor its water, not its borders. Such a mutated creation will die because it is a freak of human history.

Palestinians who were terrorized out of their homes must be given the choice to return, and all the guarantees the world can give can be implemented to safeguard this agreement and the lives of the people involved. It can be done.

Imagine if that happens. We would look back at the 20th century as a time of turmoil and cruelty, and start to look forward to a real, prosperous future built on rock.

Do I see that happening? Not any time soon. Israelis have painted themselves into a corner and are way too high on their own supply. Before that can happen, they have to be educated to recognize the changes taking place around them. They have to realize how much humiliation and incredible pain they’re projecting upon everyone around them, and that they’re, literally, making larger, more dangerous, and more determined enemies.

Just look at the photo of the chanting Israelis harassing that Palestinian woman in the next SC subject and you get a good picture of the mind set prevalent in Israel today. Peace cannot be made with this mindset at all.

Averroes,

You are entitled to an opinion. I gave your comment due consideration. I concluded that I cannot agree with you.

Keep writing, however, and enlighten us with more of your ‘philosophical’ advices.

Instead, Israelis can choose to change their ways and their approach, and agree to the only viable solution, which is a One State solution, where Arab and Jew can live and work together in a natural, normal country that belongs to all its citizens. They have to stop coming up with the mutated creations they’re offering the Palestinians such as a state over walled ghettos, that does not own its air space, nor its water, not its borders. Such a mutated creation will die because it is a freak of human history.

Averroes,

Since 1947 there has been, and there always will be, a two-state solution to the Arab-Israeli conflict. I’m not sure how someone can conclude that it is “too late” for that. What data proves this?

The Palestinians (and their arab rejectionist backers) have always spurned the two-state proposals, and, IMHO, that is the reason why the peace process has failed.

THIS IS THE WAY IT IS.

Party I keeps talking and talking about the piece process while continuously taking land and resources from P, S and L. Party I has over 200 nuclear missiles and keeps bitching about parties P, S and L acquiring non nuclear missiles.

Party I insists on being a state for just the “chosen few” who continueously claim that as Jews they are God’s chosen people and God gave them special rights and as soon as anyone mentions the word Jew that person is a racist.

Party I maintains and is supported by Party A that it has the right to defend itself ore-emptively by “attacking Parties P, S, and L as well in addition another Party named Iran.”

According to Party I parties P, S, L, and Iran do not have the SAME RIGHTS to defend themselves as Party I has.

Big Party A wants all concerned to kow tow to Party I’s demands and live peacefully.

Big big Party UN is unable to do what it is mandated to do and Party I anyhow ignores it.

A rational conclusion to the above after 60 odd years woud be the question “when is this comic opera going to end”? Who are the comics and who are the ones being made fun of ? What is the rational for Parties, P, S, L and Iran and nearby neighbors to continue to be members of Party UN that is not executing its own orders?

As things stand now Party I stands as the winner and all the rest as just plain losers. And human nature being what it is no one likes being the loser all the time.

Ghat,
That was interesting and so true , and i want to add what , Averroes,said that the longer party I keeps denying party P,S,L,I their rights the more likely more radical people will reach power and deny party I the right to exist in the first place , the question is will party I develop a strategic thinking and adopt what Shai and Yossi advocate and that live together as equal , I hope i got that right Shai, before things gets out of hand , i have strong doubts !.

NORMAN said:

i have strong doubts !. I agree with your doubts too.

60 years ago its was the Stern Gang, the Irgun Zvai Lumi murdering Count Bernadotte, running trucks with naked Palestenian women in them and throwing out close to 700,000 into Lebanon and elsewhere.

There was no Hamas, Hezbollam, Al Queda, or Taliban. who knows how many more in say 5 or ten years.

The future does not augur well for peace as you suggest. M. Gandhi has an appropriate observation on how the world turns. “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

Que sera, sera.

Ghat said: “Party I keeps talking and talking about the piece process while continuously taking land and resources from P, S and L. Party I has over 200 nuclear missiles and keeps bitching about parties P, S and L acquiring non nuclear missiles.”

Your premise insinuates that parties “P, S, and L” always wanted peace, and that party “I” only talks about it, but does the opposite. But clearly even you can recall that certain parties did not seek peace with “party I” prior to 1967. It is NOT the case, that parties “P, S, and L” were ready to accept Israel in this region, before Israel took over the West Bank, Gaza, and the Golan.

I disagree also with your suggestion that Israel is “talking about peace” while continuously “taking land”. We’re neither talking peace, nor taking more land. There’s no more to take – we have it all right now. We are building more settlements on Palestinian territory, if that’s what you mean, yes. But we already control all that territory. The question now, is if and when we’ll give that territory back. The more we wait, the more a One-State solution becomes de facto the only solution. In that sense, if certain Israelis who fear non-Jewish majority don’t wake up soon enough, they will not have the option to get their Jewish State. The Palestinians will simply refuse a non-viable state of their own.

I do agree with you, about the missile absurdity. But two things play in our favor – first, our so-called “nuclear ambiguity”, in which Israel never admitted to having nuclear capability, and second, the fact that we never used such missiles against the Arabs. We can “bitch” about missiles that have been launched against Israel, but it’s difficult for the Arab side to “bitch” against nukes that have yet to be seen.

Shai,

Israel was not recognized by party S,P,L and Egypt because Israel would not give the Palestinians their right as set by the UN of return to their homes , If Israel was working on that problem things might have been different ,

Norman,

I disagree. Egypt and Jordan recognized Israel, as did the PLO itself, long before the Palestinians achieved their national aspirations and their rights. It is also likely that Syria would do the same, if Israel were to withdraw from the Golan tomorrow.

With the exception of Lebanon, all other territories Israel currently controls and occupies, have been held since 1967. Israel hasn’t “expanded” into further territory, it has in fact withdrawn from territory under its control, namely the Sinai, S. Lebanon, Gaza, and small areas in the West Bank.

While most Israelis today do not believe we should withdraw from the Golan, polls clearly indicate that a majority understands we’ll have to withdraw from most of the West Bank. The numbers range from 90-plus percent, to about 96%. Few Israelis still believe in a Greater Israel.

But while we do nothing, a One-State is de facto becoming our reality.

NORMAN.

Interesting take of one who is on the inside so to speak.

Israel’s emerging state of psychosis
Gideon Levy writes:

Let us imagine the dream-country of most Israelis – without criticism, neither from within nor from without. It speaks in one voice and is eternally united, with devotion and cohesion; all-Jewish, that goes without saying. It stands unanimously behind its government, every government, and also, of course, behind its army, the Shin Bet security service and the Mossad espionage agency – Israel’s heroes.

There is not even a single “snitch,” no human rights organizations or peace movements, no nonprofit associations and no critical reports that are published here, or, heaven forbid, abroad. Its press never criticizes, never exposes, never investigates, publishing nothing but praise and admiration for the government and the state. It recites official statements and quotes from government and security briefings.

Every war that this dream-country wages is met immediately by nothing but cheers of approval. Any atrocity it commits in the occupied territories automatically earns across-the-board support – the most moral, the most just, the most security-oriented, in harmony. All residents must swear their allegiance, all those who wish to visit, too. Those who are faithful to Israel are welcome. All the rest must take the first plane (or truck ) out. In short, the country of one’s dreams.

But now let’s answer truthfully. Is that really the country we would want to live in? Moreover, would the world that is always-against-us appreciate and like Israel better if that was how we looked and spoke, uniform and devoid of all self-criticism?

The benchmark upon which all psychological health and pathology can be assessed is the relationship between self and other. The breakdown of this relationship at its extreme results in psychosis: a condition in which an unbridgeable chasm has opened between the individual and the world he inhabits.

Is this where Israel is heading? A nation so deranged that the only source of comfort it finds is in a conversation that it mutters to itself? A nation that lashes out at anyone who ventures too close? A nation whose existence rests on a foundation of fear?

The Palestinian refugees and their descendents must go back to the homes that they were driven from in 1947, 48, 56, 67, 73….

Foreigners who come from disparate parts of the world have no right to displace the inhabitants of Palestine who own over 97% of Palestine.

The theft of Palestine must come to an end. This theft cannot be reversed by one-,two-, three- or more states so-called solutions. The UN or League of Nations has no mandate to partition or allocate real estate or grant illegal mandates to any power.

The Middle East is currently living in a state of criminal behaviour by so-called highly developed robbers who seek to sanction criminal behaviour and to live off the proceeds of crime. This criminal state is the source of the Middle East problem. The criminal tendencies of those participating (whether they say they belong to right, left or center of this robbery enetrprise) in the acts of displacing the legal inhabitants of Palestine must be punished and they must be prevented from engaging in further criminal activities.

The issue is not that of peace or war. It is a criminal issue.

Shai,
I want to disagree with you , Hafiz Assad once said that Syria was offered the Golan for abandoning the Palestinians and their rights , Syria refused then and Syria will refuse in the future ,and that is probably the real reason Israel is not forthcoming on giving the Golan and a peace treaty with Syria, and that is the reason that Syria consider what Egypt did abandoning Syria and the Palestinians as treason , you might say that Syria if given the Golan in 2000 she would have signed a peace treaty with Israel , that could have happened because the Palestinians at that time were close to a deal with Israel ,today is very different story ,

Ghat,
What did you mean by this ,

((( NORMAN.

Interesting take of one who is on the inside so to speak.))

Inside what ?.

Norman,

“If Israel was working on that problem things might have been different…”

The problem is, that many in my country would suggest that if the Arab World had accepted the UN Partition Plan, things might also have been different.

We can’t keep going around in circles, choosing different points of reference to support claims against one another, and rejecting other points as irrelevant. We need to move ahead, by finding the courage to take chances. Israel must take a chance, by withdrawing from all Arab lands captured after 1967, and the Arab World must take a chance, by making peace (even cold peace) with Israel, also prior to a final solution to the Palestinian problem.

In both cases, Syria and Palestine, we are 90% there. The question is only which will come first. Unfortunately, I believe the U.S. and Israel are both banking on the wrong horse.

Btw, Bashar Assad has given every indication that Syria will NOT require first the Palestinian problem to be resolved. Mahmoud Abbas himself traveled to Damascus apparently to give his “blessings” to such an agreement. He too understands that there are also advantages in having Israelis first withdraw from the Golan.

Withdrawal from the Golan is far easier than from the West Bank, and therefore nothing should stop it if negotiations are restarted and an agreement is reached. Personally, I cannot see a single Israeli voting to force tens of thousands of Jewish settlers out of the West Bank, while Hamas keeps launching Qassams from Gaza. A final withdrawal will occur only under agreement. Israel is unlikely to repeat the unilateral mistakes of Lebanon and Gaza.

“and that is the reason that Syria consider what Egypt did abandoning Syria and the Palestinians as treason”

Indeed….
Treason it was, and more and more Egyptians and Jordanians are recognizing it as such day after day. Sadat who was paid for his treason a so-called Noble prize by the zionists was also made to pay for his treason at one of the most appropriate moments in his uneventful life in order to become an example. We know he’s rotting in a very low level in hell along with his zionist friends.

Egyptians are raising their voices and demanding the abrogation of the pact of shame and treason and so are the Jordanians. Hosni could not be where he is now if it wasn’t for the army of security agents around him. But sooner or later, the real Egyptians will take over and put an end to this shame and the chaotic order of theft imposed on Palestine by criminal zionists.

There shall never be peace with bandits and thieves. But certainly there can be war to put an end to this crime – unless the thieves hand back the stollen property, i.e. all of Palestine. That is as warm a it can get with these zionists.

Shai,

If there are only six million of you in Israel , peace would be a reality tomorrow , I doubt it though that you can multiply that fast , I can not do that either ,

NORMAN.

Interesting take of one who is on the inside so to speak.))

Inside what ?

Meaning that his views are not Arab views.

In this gathering, Arab intellectuals from all over the Arab world and the West unanimously agree Resistance in all its forms is the only path forward:

http://www.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/587936B1-FE91-439F-BCF9-4A548854F713.htm

Ghat,
I am from Syria ,